Pro life or Pro Choice? (Serious Debate)

[Lunawisper Sayles]

How do you feel about abortion?

Being a Pagan, I have mixed fealings about abortion.
On the one hand, I've heard that Abortions increase your chances for Breast Cancer...
There's a better fate for the child...Adoption.
Abstinence also helps...But if you must have sex, use birth control.
But if there is an accident...That's what Adoption Centers are for.

On the other hand, I believe that everyone has a right to make a choice.
That and if it is made illegal, won't the women just do backalley abortions which are more dangerous or something?
Also, what if the woman is dying from being pregnant? What if the child is dying (Incurrably, and has no chance at all of surviving the initial birth alive, as in, will be miscarriged)? What if both are dying?


I'm just not sure where to stand. I believe in "Harm None" but could abortion harm or help?


Please forgive me if this topic was already posted, if it was, I'd like to be directed to the proper topic.

[hedge*]

I am very much pro choice.
I think every woman has the right to decide what happens to them and their body.
The main issue with abortions is that every case is different and they should be treated as such.

[Wolf Heart]

I believe everyone should be allowed to make their own choices in life. I personally would never do abortion, I find life much too sacred. I'd even feel bad taking one of those "morning after" pills.

I think they should set up laws that allow abortion but put restrictions on it so the little, for lack of a better term, whores can't just have all kinds of unprotected sex because they can just get an abortion.

Blessed Be,
Wolf Heart

[wiccachicken]

Pro choice defo! If that woman is not ready to bring a child into the world... and I don't mean emotionally...I mean financially, habitually...then I believe that it's fair enough to abort the child. I would not want to raise a child in this world if I couldnt do it properly. However, I do get exceptionally annoyed when someone doesnt use contraception, gets pregnant, aborts it and then does it again!! That is just reckless and careless...

Still I am pro-choice, it's a woman's body and she has the right to do to it what she wants.

[twilight]

I'm strongly pro-choice.

I have been since I was little, about 12, and we had sex education in school and the teacher was explaining all aspects of the subject. And one girl asked about abortions and the teacher said, "I'm not telling you about abortions because you'll all either cry of be sick."

And at 12 years old I knew girls who had had abortions, and it made me so mad that the teacher let her personal views get in the way of her teaching. So thanks teacher, you made me very pro-choice.

More seriously though it angers me so much when especially men are all against abortion and they come out with such unreasonable excuses for their views like, 'Just don't have sex then.' Sex is such a huge natural part of our lives, just cutting it out is impossible and stupid to even suggest.

[[ForestWitch]]

On the one hand, I've heard that Abortions increase your chances for Breast Cancer...

Yes, but so do many other things. Everyone makes lifestyle choices that affect their chances of getting various kinds of cancer.

There's a better fate for the child...Adoption.
Abstinence also helps...But if you must have sex, use birth control.
But if there is an accident...That's what Adoption Centers are for.

This is far too simplistic. What about women whose lives are completely out of control because of mental illness or substance abuse? It's not too likely that those women are going to have a healthy pregnancy and produce an adoptable child. People aren't exactly standing in line hoping to adopt babies who suffer from drug addiction, fetal alcohol syndrom, HIV, et.

And what about those more stable women who truly can't affford another child? In that case, she probably may not be able to afford good prenatal care either, and she may not even be able to afford to get to a Planned Parenthood clinic or other free clinic once a month. Especially not if she lives in a "red state" where people are working night and day to shut those clinics down.

It's unreasonable to expect women to remain abstinent any time they don't feel they are in a position to have a child. Men certainly don't! Yes, birth control is good but it's not perfect; accidents happen even when you're careful. And women who can't use hormonally based contraception for medical reasons are often at higher risk should they become pregnant.

I personally know of a young woman whose sister died suddenly at the age of 29 from massive clotting in her brain. This was caused by a combination of birth control pills and a genetic condition which caused her blood to clot too easily (a condition which is not tested for when birth control pills are prescribed, BTW.) After her sister died, this woman was able to get tested and now knows that she can't take birth control pills or any other type of hormonal contraception. Of course, she's using barrier methods of birth control, but anyone can have an "oops" doing that.

Something as simple as taking an antibiotic can make your birth control pills fail. Sometimes women don't remember that they were told that three years ago when they went on the pill. There are dozens of reasons why even responsible women get pregnant when they didn't intend to.

That and if it is made illegal, won't the women just do backalley abortions which are more dangerous or something?

Yes, they will. History has shown us that. Making abortion illegal only means that well-off women, who can afford to travel to places where abortions are legal, will have access to safe abortions but poor, young, desperate women will not.

There are few situations in which I would, personally, have an abortion. But I've been blessed with good mental health, freedom from substance abuse, a financially stable life (and access to GOOD medical care when I was a "starving student") and good reproductive health which has made it easy for me to use both hormonal and barrier methods of birth control with good success. Not everyone is so lucky.

It's an often ignored fact that, in this country, under the Bush administration, the abortion rates have actually risen despite all the "pro-life" hysteria. Why? Because, more than at any time in the past, over these past 7 years, more and more of the middle class and working poor and dropped down below the poverty line.

I think abortion is a difficult choice for every woman who makes it and I'd like to see a world in which women didn't have to make that choice. But the way to get there isn't to make abortion illegal; it's to make it unnecessary.

I think they should set up laws that allow abortion but put restrictions on it so the little, for lack of a better term, whores can't just have all kinds of unprotected sex because they can just get an abortion.

I'd also like to see a world in which women didn't feel the need to talk about each other using this kind of derogatory language. I think it's more helpful to think about what makes women do such self-destructive things (habitually having unprotected sex is DANGEROUS, abortions are never comfortable procedures) than to write them off as "whores."

[Hera#76]

I am totally of the same tinking as Hedgewitch has so eloquently expressed. Every case is completely different and until faced with the decision and the circumstances yourself I reckon it would be very difficult to decide what you would actually do. Just my thoughts. I know some people have already decided they are pro-life and would stick by that decision.

[Wolf Heart]

I only use the word whore because of where I live. Nearly every girl in my town has either already had a baby, had an abortion, or a miscarriage. We've got 12 year olds here who are pregnant. Pretty much all of them got pregnant because they refused to use protection because as they say "it doesn't feel as good".
I have nothing against sex, it's a wonderful part of life that can be shared between two people and be a great expierence, but I can't stand people who seem not care enough about themselves or the life they will create to even try and protect themselves.

Blessed Be,
Wolf Heart

[Lunawisper Sayles]

I'm surprised! I was expecting you guys to be "No way! Abortions are against the Threefold law because...*reason*, *reason* and *reason*."
Heh

I agree with you guys, a woman should have a choice with what she does. But...Abortion should not equal Birth Control.

Everything is good in moderation.

[Sobek]

these days everyone knows what sex can result in and if people are going to have un-protected sex than it's their own stupid fault what happens too them. It is just unfortunate.

as with the abortion i suppose you could say im pro-choice. its not a lovely thing but sometimes its the best thing. whenever i get asked my opinions on abortion i always say thats a choice every girl has to make for herself...one of many reasons Sobek is glad to be a man!

[Revolpathon]

live is all about the choices we make.

but i do think you have to think important choices over before you make them like abortion

[Suppose;]

I'm pro-choice.

Like previously stated, all cases are different.
I'm not going to judge someone for the decision they make, because I've never been put in this kind of situation.

I don't know for sure if I would ever have an abortion, because like I said, I've never been put in this situation. I don't want to put my foot in my mouth, as they say.

I do know how important it is to have a choice though. I like knowing that I have the option to have one, should I ever have that choice to make. In my opinion, to take that choice away from a woman is to move backwards in time. I think that would be throwing away a lot of the progress that has been made with women's rights over the years.

[[ForestWitch]]

I only use the word whore because of where I live. Nearly every girl in my town has either already had a baby, had an abortion, or a miscarriage. We've got 12 year olds here who are pregnant. Pretty much all of them got pregnant because they refused to use protection because as they say "it doesn't feel as good".

It's not much different here, but I have to ask myself why 12 year olds are willing to risk pregnancy (and death!). I mean, to some extent, that's always been true. There were 12 year olds having unprotected sex when I was in junior high. That was before Roe vs. Wade (tells you how old I am) but it didn't keep them from having abortions. In nearly every case, they were girls who had been physically and/or sexually abused. So, my question is: what are these 12 year olds dealing with that makes them act that way? Is sexual abuse that prevalent? Is it something else that makes them feel worthless? Is it something as simple as the feeling that no future awaits them that doesn't include poverty? Is it drug abuse? (Not that we didn't have that in the 70's but we didn't have the hideously addictive "designer drugs" that kids get exposed to today.)

I teach girls that age and because I have unusually sharp hearing (I'm a musician) and often overhear conversations not really meant for me, I've been aware that in the tiny community in which I teach, someone has been "pimping" disadvantaged pre-pubescent and early adolescent girls. When I spoke to our school liaison officer about it, he told me that law enforcement is well aware of it, but hasn't been able to get any hard and fast evidence. Of course, due to budget cuts, law enforcement is horrifically understaffed here, too.

So, back to my point: thinking that you can stop abortions by legislating against them is naive. Government needs to take a good, hard, HONEST look at the underlying causes of abortion.

[Wolf Heart]

I agree with you on that ForestWitch. I am also quite surprised someone is "pimping" young girls, I do not, as far as I know, think there is anything like that going on here.
Where I live though it's become more of a popularity level type thing. You are considered more "cool" if you sleep with more guys and such. It's almost expected now of all young girls here to have sex. I was considered "lame" because I did not lose my virginity till I was about 17, but I was with the guy for some time.

Blessed Be,
Wolf Heart

[kuotetsu]

I'm pro life, I believe that we should give the child a chance to live and to see the world. As stated above, I too believe that life is too sacred. Choices are made before you commit something, not after you've done it. Why not use contraceptives and stuffs not to commit it. Accident may be prevented with proper planning, and thinking. Accidents come to people who lacks thinking. No offense to anyone, Its my opinion regarding the matter.

(I know how women feel, because I'm surrounded by such. I'm a product of that accident, and I feel so much gratitude that my mom gave me a chance to live, I don't blame her for committing it since she repays what she have done, she made me live...)

(Remember that Earth is a mother too, she let us live in her even we do such bad things, we should consider these matter...)