The Charge of Odin

[The Judge]

Now there's a common misconception, Warriors can cry, it's not whether they can but the reason for it. I haven't been able to cry for years, haven't quite figured that out yet, but a warrior will cry for a fallen comrade, of course after killing the other guy, but there is still that point when you realise you will not be able to fight along side them anymore for this lifetime. As for crying out of sentament, that's up to you. I can get the whole crying shows weakness thing but you have to remember that it isn't always weakness. Anyway, I think we can tell what I'm saying. Later, and Blesseb Be.

[hedge*]

Crying is not a weakness. It can be a strength.

[The Judge]

Very true, but people have come up the misconception of weakness, that's what I was aluding to. It's just like saying men don't cry, it's not true and the people that came up with it didn't know alot about life. Anyway, that's my two cents.

[Shaman of Bliss]

If any one here really knows me they can see I'm just in one of those moods, first I'm bitter, then venomous, then I snap to apathy, and before long I feel like a just need to go outside and run uptil I can't breath, I feel like I need to feel alive again,

oh my god... could... could I be depressed?

That actually scares me...

What ever I can't be depressed, I laugh alot I'm just being apathetic, yeah, thats it...

...just apathy.

[The Judge]

, well you could try going out side and screaming until you can't breathe, worked for me, but this may not be possible if you live in a city.

[jcrowfoot]

Judge: It is possible in a city. You go to a crowded nightclub where you can't even hear yourself think, then scream your head off. No one will know.

Oh, and Judge is right about warriors and crying. A buddy of mine who trained Green Berets said that the most important thing for a warrior to do was to NOT be a robot... because if you try to be a robot, you break easier that way. If you KNOW what your weaknesses are, you can work with them. If you don't acknowlede your weaknesses you never know your strengths.


About Thor/breserker thing... I heard it somewhere, I don't even remember where anymore. (Possibly from a friend in the SCA) But that the Wolf shirts were the planners who raided in the middle of the night and the boar shirts were the ones who faught openly on the battle field. I remember reading (I believe this latter bit is from an ADF sanctioned source, so it's got to have SOME truth to it.)

Oh my bad. the boar warriors were actually fighters for Frey. Funny how no one thinks *he's* cool anymore.

Besides, even anthropologists in the field and historians battle it out over this time period and what was actually done or believed.

It sounds like you are trying to kill your own weaknesses by picking on shaman's actually.

I should also point out that the wolf shirts weren't well liked by the general population because they used underhanded ways on (and off) the battle field. Evasive manuvers, sneak attacks, and weren't straight forward, "honsest" fighters. Sorta special forces, kinda.

The thing is, if that is true, then breserking doesn't sound like it would be very useful, save in very specific circumstances. After all, if you are doing night manuvers, or sneak attacks, you really need to have your thinking cap on.

Judge can probably correct me if I'm wrong. I've never been in a war zone, and I'm going to bow out of speculating about this any more.

Now, I agree that retreating was never an option, nor was not killing anyone who'd slighted you in the least, even if it was one chance word decades earlier (Read the Laxdæla Saga), but then, that was the spirit back then. Yes, there are things to be learnt from it, but have we not come a long way since?

I couldn't have said it better myself.

Wolf, what the heck are you trying to prove, anyway? I can see saying a few things, but you are really pushing the envelope about it. If you were a true warrior, you'd help shaman FIND the true warrior within and stop with this self aggrandizing harassment on this board. You have been warned.

It is a path not a destination, after all.

[Wolf*]

That may be what the Ulfhedinn once were but no longer. We uphold the ways of the warrior and fight honestly now. And the benefits of berserking are numerous, especially in tight situations. Pain is turned off for one, strength is nearly trippled, and your reaction time increases greatly. These are the more basic benefits.

And I'm not trying to prove anything. I was trying to help. One can not correct a flaw unless it is pointed out and shown the proper actions to take. In my posts here I have pointed out these flaws, and told him what he should try to achieve if he wishes to be a warrior of Odin. My wording my have been harsh, though I do not apologize for it. I am not trying to belittle him or pick on him, I am trying to help show him the way down the path of the warrior.

[Pav]

I have to agree with wolf here, a warrior needs to be aggressive and stand against other peoples aggression. I can see how wolfs approach could be beneficial, after all if shaman wants to be a warrior he shouldn't be overly sheltered. When it comes to flaws I'd say the most direct approach to correcting them is the best, no one said it has to be easy

[The Mystic Pilgrim]

I completely agree. In fact, I think it's hard by design. You just have to remember two very important things.

a) It is not a sign of weakness to ask for help. In fact, it can be a sign of great strength.

b) And crying - neh any emotional response - when not taken to a self destruct level (and believe me, I speak from experience on this one) can be a positive thing. They are some of our greatest teachers.

Sham, just keep your chin up and fight the good fight. You have people who are behind you.

[Shaman of Bliss]

I had Karate class last night, made me feel better, not about everything, but I am feeling more "passionate" not so robotic. I don't know, it just feels like everytime I dare to give myself a label, Shaman, warrior, whatever. Someone comes and puts doubts onto my personal clames. I understand I am not a warrior, but I was trying to be, I had passion for it, and was working towards it. Now, I feel like I'm not a warrior, not even close, I don't even feel like a man. I've fought so hard so that people will see me as an adult, earned the respect of people older then me, and in the end, I still look like a child.

its like after everything I've done, all the self searching, finding peace in the path of becoming a warrior... after all my practicing of shamanism and the experiences gathered from it, I'm still no more mature then when I started. Thats is what you have made me feel Wolf, whether or not you intended, I've been a whinie little boy, neither a man nor a warrior.

You've just debased my faith, revel in your victory.


Oh your right, warriors can cry i suppose, it doesn't matter anyway though, I'm neither a warrior or a man, and now that my emotions have returned, I'm crying as I finish this post, the emotions back, but the hurt never left.

[Wolf*]

oh my gods. Fine. You know what? You are right, you are nothing but a whiny little kid.Thats how you are comming across so fine, I'll come out and say it. Now, what are you going to do about it? You wouldn't be crying if it didn't bother you, so apparently you see it as fact and hate it. So rise above it! I've made you feel like shit? Fine, prove me wrong, prove yourself wrong. Show the world and yourself that you can become strong and that you can be a warrior. Have pride in yourself and don't back down. The road of the warrior is a path of troubles and hurt, but it is balanced by the pride and honor one feels by showing they can walk this path unscathed. So can you? This is what I'm trying to show you. Place your own weaknesses before you and face them, all your fears, all your pain, and laugh at them. Show that you are stronger than that. It's not easy, and it doesn't ever get easy. Especially with that one eyed bastard as a patron god. If you follow him, he will put these obstacles in your path to test you, to make you stronger or break you. When ragnarok comes, will you be one of the noble einherjar on the plains of Vigrid, or will you be looking from Helheim, seeing where you could have been? Odin only wants true warriors, so prove yourself, and show the world and the gods themselves what it is that you can become!

[Shaman of Bliss]

SEE I WANT TO!!! I can't find the passion! I can't rally around that cause! I want to so desperatly but I have no energy to do some, I feel like I am giving up, but I don't want to. My mind says stand up and prove yourself, but my body can barely stand. Thats why I'm so frustrated, i want this so bad, but at the same time I can't gather the passion. I don't know whats wrong with me and it scares me!!! I've alwasy known myself, known what wrong with myself and been able to fix it, I can't seem to do that. A fellow once told me to sit and think on the concept of "The wounded healer."

Maybe i'm not suppose to feel well, perhaps... this has all just been another trial...

OMG!

THANKYOU WOLF!


IT ALL MAKES SENSE! Its just another test, something I intend to beat!

I hae found the passion again, just another test... what a shame I didn't see it sooner. Back on my path I go...


...Thank you everyone, it all makes sense now, I couldn't have done it without you, even you wolf!

[Kolohe]

That may be what the Ulfhedinn once were but no longer. We uphold the ways of the warrior and fight honestly now. And the benefits of berserking are numerous, especially in tight situations. Pain is turned off for one, strength is nearly trippled, and your reaction time increases greatly. These are the more basic benefits.

Adrenaline does not turn people into superhuman fighting machines.

-Fine motor skills, precision and accuracy start to deteriorate at heart rate 115 beats per minute.
-Complex motor skills, tunnel vision, and reaction time start to become impaired at 145 beats per minute.
-Above the 175 to 200 range- more tunnel vision, depth vision also decreased, auditory exclusion, sensory input diminished no pain not necessarily so good if you can't even process where your arms and legs are going, cognitive processing may start to become irrational. Basically all you have above this range is gross motor skills,you might be strong but all you can do is blindly charge forward in one direction or run away, that's why it's called fight or flight.

Kolohe

[The Judge]

And that's why it's called Berserking.

Later,
The Judge

[Eretik]

Again,well said Judge.If I may interject.............



1. ordeal....cutting the Odinic mark into the flesh with a brand or knife,rubbing in Ash,'Ashing' [scarification if you don't know]

2.ordeal...the Midgard rite...public censure and humiliation,the will,might and humour of your peers is against you,children laugh.


3.ordeal....seeing through Grims eyes,as he hangs between worlds,dancing with madness...nine days and nights.....


Which if any/all,is the truest test of the Odinic spirit?