My friend is planning to come out (as a Dianic Wiccan) to her Christian parents with me and her (also Christian) therapist. We're thinking it would be best to draw parallels between the two faiths and maybe try to round up some scripture that supports her choice. Any thoughts?
Thank you bunches )O( blessed be!
Coming out to Christians, need parralels and/or scripture.
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love beats all (;
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Assuming they have not said anything to them yet, I am sorry to inform you that you most likely will be on an uphill battle when it comes to finding scriptures to support her choice. Of course, I could be wrong because there are over 30,000 different forms of Christianity. Some have a much more liberal point of view than others.
While the infamous Exodus 22:18 cannot be seriously used against your friend, at least not in a modernized democratic society, there are plenty of other New Testament verses that forbid the practice of witchcraft (sometimes translated as sorcery).
One of the common beliefs in Christianity is the circular logic of "the Bible is the revelations of the true God because it says so." They believe in its inerrancy, often even in the inerrancy of the translations that have occured for thousands of years (a major leap of faith there). Thus the mindset, "we must do this and not do that because the Bible says so, and the Bible is true because it says it is true." This is the basic foundation of Christianity (also true for Islam with the Koran).
There are some rare exceptions, especially among Christians who believe in Universalism and Universal reconciliation, but they are often put under fire by many other Christians who begin their predictable Bible quoting even if a Universalist tries to explain the mistranslations.
The best you can do is at least show your friend is not a devil worshipper and will not skip about sacrificing children and small animals. Also try to show parallels of believing in being "good stewards of the earth" (a Biblical term), healing, peace, etc.
While the infamous Exodus 22:18 cannot be seriously used against your friend, at least not in a modernized democratic society, there are plenty of other New Testament verses that forbid the practice of witchcraft (sometimes translated as sorcery).
One of the common beliefs in Christianity is the circular logic of "the Bible is the revelations of the true God because it says so." They believe in its inerrancy, often even in the inerrancy of the translations that have occured for thousands of years (a major leap of faith there). Thus the mindset, "we must do this and not do that because the Bible says so, and the Bible is true because it says it is true." This is the basic foundation of Christianity (also true for Islam with the Koran).
There are some rare exceptions, especially among Christians who believe in Universalism and Universal reconciliation, but they are often put under fire by many other Christians who begin their predictable Bible quoting even if a Universalist tries to explain the mistranslations.
The best you can do is at least show your friend is not a devil worshipper and will not skip about sacrificing children and small animals. Also try to show parallels of believing in being "good stewards of the earth" (a Biblical term), healing, peace, etc.
It's like walking down an empty street, listening to your own footsteps. But all you have to do is knock on any door and say, "If you'll let me in, I'll live the way you want me to live. And I'll think the way you want me to think." And all the blinds will go up, and all the doors will open, and you'll never feel lonely. Ever again.
~Henry Drummond, "Inherit the Wind" (1960)
~Henry Drummond, "Inherit the Wind" (1960)
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allyouneedislove
My favorite was always the famous "judge not lest ye be judged" that jesus himself said.
In addition, there are many instances of "magic" used in the bible (I put magic in quotes because magic and miracle could really be used interchangably), such as moses sort of duking it out with Pharoh's magicians in exodus, as well as many other things moses did himself rather than let god do (like turning the nile into blood?).
In the new testament, paul travels around healing people, and after being thrown in jail one night, he finds himself free of his chains and the door left open.
Also, there is the example of (I forget who it is, but someone who was really important in the bible) consulted with the woman of endor, (usually referred to as the witch of endor) to be able to communicate with the dead
These are just a few examples, if you need more or you want the exact passages so you can look them up yourself let me know
In addition, there are many instances of "magic" used in the bible (I put magic in quotes because magic and miracle could really be used interchangably), such as moses sort of duking it out with Pharoh's magicians in exodus, as well as many other things moses did himself rather than let god do (like turning the nile into blood?).
In the new testament, paul travels around healing people, and after being thrown in jail one night, he finds himself free of his chains and the door left open.
Also, there is the example of (I forget who it is, but someone who was really important in the bible) consulted with the woman of endor, (usually referred to as the witch of endor) to be able to communicate with the dead
These are just a few examples, if you need more or you want the exact passages so you can look them up yourself let me know
Don't forget the prophecies and the "speaking in tongues." Also both Joseph and Daniel were known for their gifts in the interpretation of dreams.
He was King Saul. The witch of endor summoned up the spirit of Samuel, who had just died. Samuel foretold of Saul's death which would happen the following day. Saul was actually berated for doing this.allyouneedislove wrote: Also, there is the example of (I forget who it is, but someone who was really important in the bible) consulted with the woman of endor, (usually referred to as the witch of endor) to be able to communicate with the dead
It's like walking down an empty street, listening to your own footsteps. But all you have to do is knock on any door and say, "If you'll let me in, I'll live the way you want me to live. And I'll think the way you want me to think." And all the blinds will go up, and all the doors will open, and you'll never feel lonely. Ever again.
~Henry Drummond, "Inherit the Wind" (1960)
~Henry Drummond, "Inherit the Wind" (1960)
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Earth Ritual
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- Location: North Carolina
* "Know ye not that ye are gods?" 1 Corinthians 3:16
* "The things that I do, ye shall do. And greater works than these shall you do, when I am gone." - Jesus (John 14:12)
* "To us Spirit has given...the power to heal the sick or the power to work mighty miracles. Some of us are prophets." Corinthians 12
Praise Jesus!
By the way this is a very Christian approach. As a witch, I would cast a spell on the parents for reconciliation, peace, and presence to their love for their child.
This coming out thing strikes of justification and defense to me, which is always a loosing game with Christians. In my world there is no such thing as coming out as a witch, rather, there are boundaries a witch creates (protection spell work) that has someone think twice before casting a judgment or discrimination.
* "The things that I do, ye shall do. And greater works than these shall you do, when I am gone." - Jesus (John 14:12)
* "To us Spirit has given...the power to heal the sick or the power to work mighty miracles. Some of us are prophets." Corinthians 12
Praise Jesus!
By the way this is a very Christian approach. As a witch, I would cast a spell on the parents for reconciliation, peace, and presence to their love for their child.
This coming out thing strikes of justification and defense to me, which is always a loosing game with Christians. In my world there is no such thing as coming out as a witch, rather, there are boundaries a witch creates (protection spell work) that has someone think twice before casting a judgment or discrimination.
You are either for Life or against It. There is no in between.
I used to believe in god above. Now I'm filled with so much love.-Erykah Badu after the invocation of the Goddess
May the love that holds eternity at its fingertips kiss each and everyone one you on the lips. May your words bring worlds that bring hope to a world dying to be reborn.
I used to believe in god above. Now I'm filled with so much love.-Erykah Badu after the invocation of the Goddess
May the love that holds eternity at its fingertips kiss each and everyone one you on the lips. May your words bring worlds that bring hope to a world dying to be reborn.
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WitchyLady506
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- Location: St. Louis
I'm with Earth Ritual, you can spout bible verses til you've quoted the entire bible, tell them about how prayer is witchcraft, that asking Jesus into your heart is invocation or that the Sunday morning church service is nothing more than a group evocation, but it won't matter. The thing is, she's saying she doesn't except Jesus as her personal savior and swear a life to serving him in some manner or another, which is just wrong to them.
I think the best approach her is for her to discuss about how she doesn't know how she feels about Christianity, as she's probably a teenager and her feelings will change over time and she wants to look around at other beliefs and what not before she makes such a big decision in her life. Now she doesn't have to do so, though I do always encourage fully examining your personal beliefs, not just going oh that sounds nice, I'm gonna be that, like so many do at first. From there she can practice what ever she wants. After a while of the initial shock and hopefully her parents understanding while she does the best to be a good adolescent, her parents will see that they have an amazing daughter and when she does tell them she's been Wiccan all along or if she decides upon something else, it won't matter because they will have seen their daughter for who she truly is, not her religion.
Also, encourage your friend to try and get along with her parents as much as possible, as this will help the situation. Her parents only want what's best for her, even if they aren't sure what it is. she needs to be herself but maintain the respect that everyone should have for the people who put a roof over their head and food in their mouths. Too many teenagers go on about how their parents don't understand and how they're forcing them to be such and such, but they don't take the time to realize that they are forcing something on their parents that maybe hard for them to deal with, so it's best to ease into this type of issue, as if it's not handled well, it can be a very bad situation for her and you, since you're trying to help her. Her parents may think you're a bad influence. So you both should show them how you're both perfect angels while you practice witchcraft without them knowing.
This is just how I would go about such things.
I think the best approach her is for her to discuss about how she doesn't know how she feels about Christianity, as she's probably a teenager and her feelings will change over time and she wants to look around at other beliefs and what not before she makes such a big decision in her life. Now she doesn't have to do so, though I do always encourage fully examining your personal beliefs, not just going oh that sounds nice, I'm gonna be that, like so many do at first. From there she can practice what ever she wants. After a while of the initial shock and hopefully her parents understanding while she does the best to be a good adolescent, her parents will see that they have an amazing daughter and when she does tell them she's been Wiccan all along or if she decides upon something else, it won't matter because they will have seen their daughter for who she truly is, not her religion.
Also, encourage your friend to try and get along with her parents as much as possible, as this will help the situation. Her parents only want what's best for her, even if they aren't sure what it is. she needs to be herself but maintain the respect that everyone should have for the people who put a roof over their head and food in their mouths. Too many teenagers go on about how their parents don't understand and how they're forcing them to be such and such, but they don't take the time to realize that they are forcing something on their parents that maybe hard for them to deal with, so it's best to ease into this type of issue, as if it's not handled well, it can be a very bad situation for her and you, since you're trying to help her. Her parents may think you're a bad influence. So you both should show them how you're both perfect angels while you practice witchcraft without them knowing.
This is just how I would go about such things.
They say only Silver Bullets kill the beast inside.....