Possibly Controversial: expanding the mind, including drugs

[Victoria Mnemosyne]

There are those out there who believe that they can expand the mind through meditation, astral projection, dreams, and a similar but much more controversial method, drug use.
hallucinagenics are common in many different religions- native american religions, prominantly, and may have been responsible for revered ancient greek oracles.
nowadays, the topic is highly controversial and because of negative connotations (the druggie, knife carrying, all around shady character) (or the burnt out old hippie, timothy leary type)
what are your thoughts on the subject, and if you dont feel comfortable disclosing your personal views, do you believe this is a valid element of spirituality for those who consider it such?

[Victoria Mnemosyne]

just to make a few things clear:

i dont mean to imply that those who practice meditation are like drug users... the connection would be stronger with dreaming, since dreams are induced by similar brain chemicals as those that produce hallucinations.

also, i am NOT trying to start a debate or incite controversy.
there is a personal connection with people in my life, that i choose not to disclose (partly because the situation itself is irrelevent insofar as "he said, and then SHE said, and then he called her stupid!" and also, out of respect)... what i am asking is a thoughtful question about what can be considered "spiritual" in nature.

i hope i don't inadvertently offend anyone.

[shadowx]

I live by the idea that so long as you arent harming anyone i dont care what you or anyone else does, that includes drugs.

However.... If someone is taking hallucinogens and claiming to be talking to dead people, seeing unicorns and flying to other worlds.... I laugh.

You cant trust or believe anything you experience while under the effects of any hallucinogen, that includes while dreaming. As a spiritual practise i see it as irresponsible and foolish.

In general life i think it's pretty sad if someone has to take drugs to enjoy themselves, they clearly arent a very interesting or fun person

[Peregrine]

I understand that drug use has existed in the history of some religions. The Dionysians used to get into a drunken frenzy during their rituals. People make jokes about "booze parties" and the god of wine, but it was actually a serious attempt at communion with their deity during its time.

I am of the opinion that drugs should never be used. They interfere with the experience rather than enhance it. Oftentimes the user also runs the risk of addiction, or at least negative side affects of long term use. One should have a clear and focused mind, which drugs by their very nature do not allow.

In meditation, for instance, I often see reports of falling asleep on accident. Unless you are a very skilled lucid dreamer, it is a bit difficult to achieve any awareness when that happens. With drugs, the problem is much worse.

[Traumwandlerin]

Drugs can surely be useful (though I never took any) but before using them, make sure you've got the skills and are experienced enough to do your magic/astral projection without the use of drugs. Cause otherwise you wouldn't be able to distinguish between random hallucination and important message and also you wouldn't know how to deal with some of the more dangerous travels.

But when you are already skilled, I guess drugs could intensify the experience. But, when you are already skilled, you should know that more intense is just not neccessary and you already have everything you need