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Let's Discuss What Is A "Real Witch"

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Let's Discuss What Is A "Real Witch"

Postby Shawn Blackwolf » Tue Mar 21, 2017 11:36 am

I have been on and off the net and pagan forums for years.

I have lost count of how many times I have had this conversation, or needed to clarify the different forms of witchcraft with other pagans and witches on the web.

Yet it seems once again this is necessary, as I just saw a post that stated "real witches" did not engage in dark magic because it was against their Rede. So, I would appreciate having a respectful discussion regarding this and bringing
more clarity on this site to this issue.

I ask everyone obey the laws of the site while discussing this, yet be honest about their thoughts and path(s) and what their definition of a *real witch" is.

I shall wait for a bit to express my feelings and beliefs so as not to imprint pre-existing ideas into the discussion.

So here we go.

Just how do *you* define a "real witch"?
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Re: Let's Discuss What Is A "Real Witch"

Postby Ashrend » Tue Mar 21, 2017 12:00 pm

A 'real' witch in my opinion is someone who engages with magic of some level even if it's just spiritually. Witchcraft to me is like when someone says science. Science has so many levels to it and different approaches to different tasks and idea such as string theory and quantum loop. Regardless if the science aims to create a weapon of mass destruction or to find out why an axolotl has translucent skin, it's still science. Magic is the same in that it doesn't matter if you are creating curses and using 'dark' magic, or using crystal for healing. It is all magic and those that use it are witches just as someone who studies the way are world works is a scientist.
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Re: Let's Discuss What Is A "Real Witch"

Postby tutmosis » Tue Mar 21, 2017 12:17 pm

I agree. A witch is someone who practices magick, no matter if it's high (white) or low (black) magick.
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Re: Let's Discuss What Is A "Real Witch"

Postby Shawn Blackwolf » Tue Mar 21, 2017 12:40 pm

So, a question, then. There are many who confuse Witch and Wiccan, and assume all real Witches are Wiccans, but this has never been the way as I know it.

All Wiccans are Witches, but not all Witches are Wiccans. And not all of us follow a Law of Three, nor the Rede of today.

I respect it if someone does. That is their choice, not *always* mine.

Feedback?

Should we all be defined by modern Wiccan ways?
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Re: Let's Discuss What Is A "Real Witch"

Postby Ashrend » Tue Mar 21, 2017 12:47 pm

As far as I know, wicca is an umbrella term meaning any modern day practices instead of old traditional practices. I'm not big on labels unless it is to help yourself and give yourself purpose for being that label.
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Re: Let's Discuss What Is A "Real Witch"

Postby Shawn Blackwolf » Tue Mar 21, 2017 12:59 pm

What you just posted about Wicca being an "umbrella term" is one of the cruxes of the problem...

Modern day Wicca, was instituted by Gerald Gardner and a few others as a *form* of the larger spectrum of Witchcraft in the 1950's, and beyond. Witchcraft stretches into the remote past, without the rules or ways, espoused, and practiced by Modern day Wiccans...;)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerald_Gardner_(Wiccan)
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Re: Let's Discuss What Is A "Real Witch"

Postby SpiritTalker » Tue Mar 21, 2017 1:15 pm

Broadly, I'd say a witch is someone who feels a connection with the Earth and/or natural forces, and particularly one who uses this resonance to empower their will in creating desired changes. In short, a witch practices witchcraft.

A Wiccan follows a spiritual path & that may adopt the ideal of the Rede to guide their magical actions, preferring not to intentionally harm another life, as Life is sacred; the magical equivalent of conscientious objectors.

A definition provides a context for communicating ideas only.
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Re: Let's Discuss What Is A "Real Witch"

Postby Ashrend » Tue Mar 21, 2017 1:38 pm

Fair point. I'll keep that in mind blackwolf.
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Re: Let's Discuss What Is A "Real Witch"

Postby moonraingirl » Tue Mar 21, 2017 1:40 pm

This reminds me of "No true Scotsman" fallacy http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/No_True_Scotsman

It would be better to say for example, that ideal witch doesn't use black magic. Or that according to wiccan philosphy, using black magic is forbidden. Obviously, there are many more witches in the world who are not familiar with wicca. Wicca is a rather Western-centred modern-ish philosophy. There are many other spiritualities in the world that work with nature.
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Re: Let's Discuss What Is A "Real Witch"

Postby Shawn Blackwolf » Tue Mar 21, 2017 2:04 pm

True enough, Spirit Talker, and Moon Rain Girl. Yet here is another point, Spirit Talker. What if a Witch focuses on Star Magic?

Do they *have* to focus on Earth Magic, to be a Witch? And Moon Rain Girl, is an "ideal witch" idea any better than a "real witch?"

And telling some African Witches, or Mexican/Meso American Witches that they were not "real witches" if they practiced forms of "black magic," might be rather dangerous, if not just disrespectful, wouldn't it ? ...;)

I agree.

However, even in Europe especially Old Europe, or the Mediterranean, or Egypt, or island or Aboriginal cultures, the Witchcraft was practiced, and now it seems we have a magical policy political correctness policing attempting to be instituted, deciding what is a real, ideal, or proper Witch.

( shakes head , wondering at modern state of affairs )...lol

Binxy, glad I could help bring some light to the situation, regarding the origin of Modern Day Wicca, and that is only the tip of the iceberg. Most modern day Witches do not even do much research into their origins.
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Re: Let's Discuss What Is A "Real Witch"

Postby SpiritTalker » Tue Mar 21, 2017 2:40 pm

Blackwolf, the first word I wrote was "broadly", and I referred to natural forces, thus extraterrestrial considerations may apply. :mrgreen: in my absolute opinion, no real witch would be caught dead without striped socks, but I wouldn't force it on the sky clad.
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Re: Let's Discuss What Is A "Real Witch"

Postby moonraingirl » Tue Mar 21, 2017 2:42 pm

Shawn Blackwolf wrote:And Moon Rain Girl , is an "ideal witch" idea any better than a "real witch" ?


What I meant was to stress a difference between making a judgementl vs philosophical claim. In my opinion, in this case it is not correct to judge someone of not being a real witch. However, one can express their opinion about what an ideal goal of a witch in their interpretation should be.
For example, I can say that an ideal Christian is always loving and kind and observes all Christian traditions. That would be an acceptable claim. But I cannot pick a random person and say that they are not a Christian.

Hope it makes sense :)

Then there is another possibility. That would be to agree that only wiccans are witches and we would have to apply other terms for those who work with natural energies but are not wiccan. Then we could say that since wiccan religion requires working only with positive forces, all witches only work with good intentions. (that would be an equivalent of saying that all Christians believe in Jesus).
As far as I know, term witch has more meanings in English, not only wiccan, so such approach wouldn't be good.
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Re: Let's Discuss What Is A "Real Witch"

Postby Shawn Blackwolf » Tue Mar 21, 2017 3:02 pm

SpiritTalker wrote:Blackwolf, the first word I wrote was "broadly", and I referred to natural forces, thus extraterrestrial considerations may apply. :mrgreen: in my absolute opinion, no real witch would be caught dead without striped socks, but I wouldnt force it on the sky clad.


More than fair enough...well said...;)

And in my neighborhood , we have a sock store called Pippi Longstocking's, where they actually, and purposefully sell high top red and white striped socks. Perfect for the witch who chooses them. Check it out !

Better site on facebook :

https://www.facebook.com/PippiSocks/
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Re: Let's Discuss What Is A "Real Witch"

Postby Shawn Blackwolf » Tue Mar 21, 2017 3:15 pm

Nice post, Moon Rain Girl. I like the "judgement vs philosophical claim" concept. And to me this brings up another point. On another site, recently, someone posted about pop culture, and chaos magic, and using pop culture icons in ritual. And the validity of that form of Witchery.

Here is the video she used to illustrate her point. It is very interesting, at least to me. See what you think...and anyone else who watches it.

"Real Witch"?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GXBms6vdNWU
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Re: Let's Discuss What Is A "Real Witch"

Postby TwilightDancer » Tue Mar 21, 2017 3:19 pm

SpiritTalker wrote:Broadly, I'd say a witch is someone who feels a connection with the Earth and natural forces, and particularly one who uses this resonance to empower their will in creating desired changes. In short, a witch practices witchcraft.


Kind of hit the nail on the head there ST. :fairy:
Lady stir your cauldron well, chant your words and sing your spell
Come and taste of the cauldron's brew and magic she will give to you

TwilightDancer's Book of Shadows
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