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Christian Wiccan Beliefs

Discussion for and about Christian witches and pagans. How do you merge your two belief systems? Please be kind to Christian witches. I have come to believe that it is a very valid belief system.

Christian Wiccan Beliefs

Postby mel1402 » Tue Mar 15, 2011 7:10 am

Hi there

I wanted to ask a question, but don't want to sound ignorant or blinkered. I was raised Christian, but always challenged my bible class teacher about whether there was a Mother God if there was a Father God. As you can imagine, that didn't go down too well. Anyway, as I understand things, Wiccans believe in a divine male and female, yet Christians believe in the one true Father God.

My question is do Christian Wiccans believe in a divine male and female deity as a Wiccan or just in a God figure, as a Christian. I would like to think that belief in Jesus as your chosen male deity would be fine as it is my belief that he was a very prominent man of his day, worthy of worship and worthy to be chosen by a Wiccan as their God. I do however struggle to understand how Christianity and Wicca can blend into one belief.

Would people mind helping me unravel this in my mind and discuss it with me?
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Re: Christian Wiccan Beliefs

Postby EveningJade » Tue Mar 15, 2011 8:22 pm

Well, seeing as how I don't hold much to the Christian side of things in my faith, I wouldn't have much to say about this. But i did read something i found very interesting. In his book, Raymond Buckland explained that in order to combat student accusations of us being some sort of demonic religion, he said to tell people that you do worship A devine Father or God, but that you also worship a Devine Goddess, and that in relation to Christianity, Mary is thought to fulfill the role of being the devine Goddess.

A very interesting thought in my mind.
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Re: Christian Wiccan Beliefs

Postby jinlee916 » Sat Mar 26, 2011 2:56 pm

I really don't think it matters because if you are a christian you are still a wiccan right????
you have magick in your blood circulating you all around you. Don't you think our father gave us that gift??? Im born a christian and im proud to be a wicca and a christian! let the fire burn!
believe your talents and use it before your time runs out.
may you find your destiny soon. :P
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Re: Christian Wiccan Beliefs

Postby stariebird11 » Tue Nov 29, 2011 8:36 pm

jinlee916- nicely said :) i think of the goddess as the feminine side of God, the motherly side. The sun, or god, is like the protective side of a father. And the Moon, the goddess, is like the soothing embrace of a mother. that is just my simple view being Christian and Wiccan. A little confusing, no? :D
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Re: Christian Wiccan Beliefs

Postby Ula » Wed Nov 30, 2011 11:18 am

Some view the Father as the male aspect of creation and Sophia (Holy Spirit) as the female aspect. You could use Mary and Jesus. Some use angels with the directions. It's what you are comfortable with.
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Re: Christian Wiccan Beliefs

Postby Lady Cael » Thu Aug 16, 2012 6:53 pm

Old post is old, but I worship Mary as a Goddess, and the Holy Spirit as a Goddess. Along with God and Jesus. :)
)O( May the Goddess be with you as you learn and question, walk in peace and Blessed Be , love Lady Cael
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Re: Christian Wiccan Beliefs

Postby Truthseeker » Thu Aug 16, 2012 11:11 pm

You might find Coven of Christ website helpful. Google christian witch.There are quite a few christian wiccan sites out there. It IS a valid belief system. People say you cannot combine the two but I do. I believe that a true witch/wiccan is a better follower of the teachings of Jesus than most christians ever thought of being.
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Re: Christian Wiccan Beliefs

Postby Lady Cael » Sun Aug 19, 2012 4:12 pm

Thanks for the advice, I'll check the site out! :)
)O( May the Goddess be with you as you learn and question, walk in peace and Blessed Be , love Lady Cael
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Re: Christian Wiccan Beliefs

Postby Sage50 » Tue Oct 16, 2012 10:29 am

I am a Chistian and magic is in my blood I did my first spell when I when I was 16 and I was fill with the holy spirit at 30. the spirit has lead me to this path of wiccian. I believe Jesus used a form of magic that heal the people. I belief Mary was a demigod the spirit is the Mother and God the Father and Jesus is their son. Jessu told us the look for the truth and work out you own savation. So that what I will do, because the churches or not telling use the truth.

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Re: Christian Wiccan Beliefs

Postby Truthseeker » Wed Oct 17, 2012 7:31 am

All I can add here is- well said- the church does NOT tell the truth. It would hurt them too much.
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Re: Christian Wiccan Beliefs

Postby loona wynd » Fri Feb 21, 2014 9:20 am

I dont think that Christianity and Wicca work as religion combinations. There are many reasons the religions don't work together on face value. A lot of the reasons that the religions don't combine can be found in the basic theology and mythology of both religions. I'm going to share a few of the reasons I don't believe they can work together as religions. That being said I do think that Christianity and Witchcraft can work together and you can be a Christian witch.

This response comes both from working a combination of the faiths for years and with in depth study of the theology and lore of both religions. So I have experience in the attempt at melding both belief systems. I have experience trying to hold two belief systems together and work effective rituals with the two systems. After a time I found that it didn't work. I was true to neither of the religions by doing the work. So I'm not completely blind to trying to make it work. I tried and my experience has said one thing and that is when you mix the two religions you are being true to neither of them at the time.

So here we go. I'm going to start out with the concept of being a witch rather than being Wiccan. I figure this is a good place to start the post and the analysis of my experience and why the two religions really can't work together. I say this because I've found most Christian Wiccans are looking more for being a witch rather than anything else. Because so many books out there illustrate that Wicca and witchcraft are the same thing many people hold this belief and thus try to combine belief systems that may not work.

Its important to remember that witchcraft is a craft. You can be a witch without being Wiccan. Wicca then is a very specific religion. While all Wiccans are witches not all witches are Wiccan. I've actually personally found that there are more witches out there who are not Wiccan than witches that are Wiccan. This is because witchcraft as a craft can be applied to basically any religion or philosophy.

So if witchcraft can be applied to Christianity why can't Wicca? Well there are several reasons. The largest one is that they are both religions (Christianity and Wicca). Witchcraft is a craft not bound by theology or belief. This is why it can be applied to Christianity while Wicca may be more difficult or impossible to actually merge effectively.

When you work and combine religious philosophies there is a lot of study involved. You need to look at the theology, mythology, lore, and cultures of the two religion before they can be combined. There are theological reasons where the two religions don't combine well. There are mythological reasons why they don't work together and there is a general worldview of the two that does not exist together. The teachings do not work together in this fashion. I'll elaborate.

Lets start out with the very basic aspect of the mythology-the Gods being worshiped. The first is that one is an arguably monotheistic religion. It is mentioned several times in the bible that Yaweh/Jehova/Allah is the only God in those religions. It is a sin and against his very essence and desire to worship gods other than him. Yet the bible does mention the existence of other Gods. For this reason Christianity is arguable not just monotheistic but also henotheistic. Henotheism then is open to the belief in other gods but you still only worship one. They exist or you admit that there are possibilities of other Gods while you focus on the one.

Wicca on the other hand is a duotheistic religion where there is a specific God and a specific Goddess. In traditional Wicca they have specific names only known to the initiates. In modern and solitary practice they are simply known as the Lord and Lady. They are specific beings with specific mythology. They are a mated pair and work together. They have a specific way to be worshiped and they have specific sabbats.

So the God in Wicca is not just any God but a specific God. When you merge the two religions you are taking the Gods out of the context in which they are worshiped. You are placing a different God in a different role. The two gods even have different names. By using a different name for the God in Wicca you remove the actual God of Wicca from his religion and practice and replace it with another god. This is disrespectful to them both.

The Goddess in Wicca is the same thing. Its important to remember that Mary is not a Goddess. Mary was a human woman yes she was blessed to birth Jesus and that is why she is petitioned to and prayed to but that does not make her a Goddess. The Goddess in Wicca is eternal and always was eternal. She never was a human nor ever has had a human form. By saying that Mary is the Goddess you remove the context of the Goddess of Wicca and the context for the veneration and prayers said to Mary. Again it is very disrespectful to very powerful entities.

So I touched a bit on the very nature of the Gods and their worship. I touched on the nature of the religions. Now I am going to be a little more specific and open. There is something about the nature of the Gods in both religions that really needs to be understood here and that is how they feel about multiple God views and worship. Wicca is duotheistic and Christianity is Monotheistic/Henotheistic.

Wiccans can belong to more than one religion. The Gods of Wicca are not jealous Gods. They just ask that their rituals are done in their honor and that you keep them in your mind as you serve them. Many traditional Wiccans have other Gods they worship separate from the God and Goddess of Wicca. This other religion and these other Gods are worshiped seperatly thought and with different rituals. The worship of other Gods in a Wiccan format is just not appropriate to them and would be disrespectful. So while they allow the worship of other Gods, it must be separate and a distinct practice.

This here is another difference in the worldview. The God of Christianity is a jealous God. This is why he decrees that his children worship only him. There are numerous examples in the bible of how he punishes his children if they stray from the path and worship some one else, even if that being was there to go between humanity and him. He wants all the love and attention from his children.

Now we are going to get into the e nature of the worship and thus the general nature of the religion. Both religions have very drastic differences in their approach to experience of God. They both have drastically different set ups in how the religions are practiced as well. These differences also make it impossible to work them together as they are two different types of religions.

Christianity is a religion based on belief. In Christianity you don't need to go to Church to follow the religion. You just need to hold specific beliefs to be Christian. Those beliefs are that there is one God. That his Son was born and died on the cross for our sins as the ultimate sacrifice, and that only through understanding Jesus and his relationship with God can you reach Heaven. There are rituals like baptisim and confirmation that many go through with their local churches, but they are not required to be Christian.

Wicca is not a religion based on belief. Wicca is a religion based on practice and experience. By performing the rituals of Wicca you gain experience of the Gods. It is through the invocations in the rituals that we experience the God and Goddess of Wicca. This is why belief in the God and Goddess is actually not as important. You don't need belief as you have experience and personal knowledge. There is a saying about Wicca and witches that typically goes "Witches dont believe. We know". This is true. The ritual structure of Wicca and the performance of those rituals is how we experience the Gods and get to know them.

Here now is another difference between the approaches to the experience of God. In Christianity only an ordained minister can perform the rites of the church. Only one who has gone through seminary can preach, teach, and perform the rites of the religion. While there are rooms and places for members of the church to serve in the church and be a part of the community (sunday school teachers, choir directors, deacons, acolytes, etc) they themselves are not the ones asking God to be there. Its only the -priest that does that.

In Wicca there are covens yes. However everyone in the coven is able to perform their own rites and gain personal experience with the God that way. You can preach, teach, and perform all your own rites as a Wiccan. You are the only one that controls your relationship and experience of God and Goddess. Yes covens have High Priests and High Priestesses that lead the actual coven rituals and worship. That is true. However ever member of a coven and every solitary Wiccan has the power to perform the rites themselves as well. There is not a priest standing between them telling them what God says. As a Wiccan when you perform the rites you also speak to the Gods yourself.

Finally we get to one of the key concepts that I feel really makes the difference between the religions. In Christianity if you read Genisis and the creation story (both accounts) you see that God tells us we are given the world to do what we want with. Humans are the stewards of the earth. We can do what we want and it will always be here. That is the basic teaching of the bible in regards to humans and their relationship with the earth. The earth for Christianity then is not alive but something that is dead and to be exploited to be used.

In Wicca and most pagan religions that is not the case. The earth in Wicca is viewed as sacred. It is viewed as being alive. We are viewed as being a part of nature and a part of the earth rather that the stewards or owners of the world. Here there are beliefs about animism and spirits filling the worlds. In Wicca we are seen as part of nature and that we are responsible for taking care of nature. That if nature leaves and dies we will die with it.

In the end its simple. Can you be Pagan and still have a relationship with them? Yes. Can you be Wiccan and have a relationship with them? yes. Worship them? You probably could but it would be against the primary monotheistic teachings. You would be a heretic not true to the teachings passed down but still able to have your own relationships.

Basically you can do anything you want spiritually. I can't stop you. Does that mean its respectful or within the actual teachings of a religion? No. If you want to be a Christian and Wiccan then try to make it work. Just know that in at least one of those religions you will be considered a heretic. If you can live with that view then go for it.

So I know this has been long but I hope I have given you some clear examples and reasons why I dont see them as being able to work together as a religion. If you have any specific questions or comments on what I have said please feel free to ask me. I'm more than willing to answer them. This combination did not work for me, at least in the long run, but it did serve as a way to transition from one worldview to another.

Now I as a witch still believe in Jesus. I still believe in Yaweh/Jehova/Allah. I just no longer worship them. I know they are real and still respect them. I just don't worship them is all. I do occasionally go to their church services when asked by family or friends but they are not my focus. I just started work with angelic forces. So as a witch I have found ways of honoring my belief in Yaweh without being a member of any of his religions.
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Re: Christian Wiccan Beliefs

Postby loona wynd » Fri Feb 21, 2014 9:23 am

Truthseeker wrote:All I can add here is- well said- the church does NOT tell the truth. It would hurt them too much.
Stonewitch

The church has also changed the bible and the tenants of Christianity over time for social and political reasons. This has been documented by historians. There are several books of the bible now called "the banned books of the bible" These are books that often challenged the patriarchal establishment of the church as well as the no magic and witchcraft aspects that had been drilled in. One of those books is the book of Enoch where we really learn about the angelic war, Enoch, and the giants mentioned in the old testament when the mention angels marring and bedding human women.
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Re: Christian Wiccan Beliefs

Postby Kat » Tue Apr 01, 2014 6:11 pm

I see this is an old thread but I thought this conversation's important and should continue.
I think the two religions are incompatible. for the reasons loona stated (yes i read it all). maybe it's simple and obvious but whatever belief goes against the rede and the threefold law has nothing to do with wicca. who burnt and insists on converting the other? harm none huh? and I'm trying not to mention the similarities of the horned god with the christian satan. or their equating our pentacle with the satanic one.
*Blessed Be*
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